Home > Cricket Development > News: ACC Trophy Day 4 Round Up…..

News: ACC Trophy Day 4 Round Up…..

In case you were wondering, I did not do a round up of day 3 because it was the most pointless day in the history of regional tournaments….. Day 4 was better, so here goes….

Singapore have beaten Oman….. an upset, though Singapore managed it very easily….. what the hell is this? Oman is sitting in Div II of the WCQS……. and they cant even top Singapore?!?! Now it looks like it may be a Oman v Nepal Quarter Final…..

Biggest Shocker has come in the Saudi Arabia v UAE match, where the Saudi team scored nearly 300 runs, and lost only by 3 wkts to UAE, who at one point looked like they would lose……. Now I have renewed respect for the standard of Malaysia cricket team…… the Malaysia v UAE game should be interesting…..

Another great game of cricket was played between Myanmar and Hong Kong, where Hong Kong won by 422 runs….. in a 45 over match…. Hong Kong made 442 in 45 overs, and in reply Myanmar managed 20……. looks like Myanmar is the next big thing in Asia….. they should do the right thing….. fire all their indegenous players, and hire some players from India, Pakistan or Sri lanka, becuase thats the way to go in Asia…….

Qatar beat Thailand by 7 wkts in 44 overs……. expected, but I think Thailand will consider this to be an improvement over their previous performances where expat based teams used to thrash them around like anything……. Perhaps Rego can clarify for us what the status of the Thai team by itself is vis a viz born and bred and expat players in the line up…….

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Categories: Cricket Development
  1. Nishadh Rego
    August 17, 2006 at 4:14 am

    Yeah I think thailand used to be myanmar and bhutan of Asia four years ago, but obviously this has changed. The thailand team this time has 6 players from the U-19 team that played in Nepal last year. Had me and one of our opening bowlers whos in canada, gone, it wouldve been 8 U-19 players in the team, all of whom have played all their cricket in Thailand. Richard Bowater, the wicketkeeper, is the only player who you could call a full blown expat in this team, as hes only been in the country 4 years. The rest of the team have been playing their cricket in the country for over 7 years. Zeeshan Khan did play for Pakistan A about 11 years ago, but hes been in Thailand for 9 years. John Hottinger, the opener who scored fifty, has a Thai mother and an English father, and is coaching the region of Khon Khaen up north. My point is, this team is basically a mix of indigenous players, indians/pakis with citizen ship and alot of young guys whove played all their cricket in Thailand. My take on this improved performance would be the fact that Thailand is now an associate member of the ICC. The last year has brought a welcome revenue of funds, which has led to better facilities, development, and training programs. The improved performance is only a result of all of these factors, and we will only keep improving.

    The results today tend to reiterate my point about Asia. Saudi Arabia and Singapore have proven that there is no hierachy in the Asian non test playing arena, unlike in Europe Africa or the Americas.

    I din’t like your comment about Myanmar and searching for the expats. To be fair, the reason the Gulf has so many expats is because they have very small ethnic populations. Many of these “expats” are citizens or have lived there for 20 years. The reason their levels are so high is because of the sheer number of tournaments organized in these countries between these expats, which keeps the level going. Don’t only point the finger at Asia.
    Is Tanmay Mishra considered an expat? Omer Hussain Majid Haq Sean Weeraratna Asim Butt are all Asian! Andre Botha and Dewald Nel are South African with the latter only moving to scotland 7 years ago. Trent Johnson played all his cricket in australia before moving to ireland 10 years ago! Look at the netherlands. Adeel Raja mohammed Kashif Atse Buurman Mudhassar Bukhari Peter Borren (NZ U-19). Denmark have predominantly “pakistani” junior teams. Germany Norway France Austria are all filled with “expats.” Canada are an expat team. Osinde is Ugandan, Bhatti Naresh Patel Abdool Samad Puvendran Dhaniram Dhillon are all Asians. Stuart Heaney played 1st grade cricket for my uni a year ago!..
    The point i’m trying to make is that the whole “expat” factor should not be dumped onto Asia because its happening all over the world, and isn’t a problem there.

  2. August 17, 2006 at 4:42 am

    Mishra is not an expat….. he is a minority……. born and bred Kenyan……. Weeraratne, Omer Hussain etc. are all minority players, not expats, except for maybe Asim Butt…… I consider born and bred players (you can also include players who have learnt either all or most of their cricket in the new country) to be better than expats, because they represent the system, and are citizens of the country in any case………. I also consider expats to be better than imports (Davison, Billcliff, Barnet etc.) because the expats at least live in the country and will at least get their kids into the game over there……. There is one radical difference between some of the European teams (like Ireland) and the Gulf teams playing expats…….. there maybe quite a few locals playing the domestic game in Top Europe associates and the national team have a few expats………. but it is still a mix, not total expat based teams………. the Gulf teams are ALL expats, less than 10 arabs playing even the domestic club game (if that many)………. thats only comparable with US…… and with Canada to some extent…………. but you are right that the expat issue is not just limited to Asia……. but it hits you in the face in Asia!!!

  3. Nishadh Rego
    August 17, 2006 at 6:17 am

    That is only because the population pyramids in the Gulf indicate that 60% of the population is of Pakistani, Indian, or Sri Lankan origin. I agree some of these people are here just to earn some money for 10 years and go back to Pakistan, but alot of them have settled in these places and live their whole lives here. I know for a fact taht Oman, UAE, Kuwait are predominantly like this. I don’t know much about Saudi and Bahrain. Shouldn’t these people be considered minorities as well? I agree that not many locals have taken to the sport in comparison to Europe, however that is because of the nature and social structures of the populations. The Arabs are rich, affluent and do not get involved in the menialities of sport, except for soccer, but thats a different story. For development officers to just reach out to the Arabs is harder than expected.

    In Thailand, and Singapore are probably a bit different because even though both have expats in their sides, the scope for the locals to get into the game is alot higher. Singapore are hindered by the fact that all singaporean nationals have to do 2 years compulsory army service at the age of 20. I know for a fact that they have about 15 ethnic singaporeans (chinese, tamil, muslim) who are good enough to be in the national team. Thailand on the other hand is still developing in this aspect, but a large number of its players are home born and bred. Hong Kong is similar to the Gulf states.

    To an extent, what you are saying is right, but Gulf population numbers, ethnicties and structure make them a unique set of countries, that have to be shown leniancy at least at this stage. and who knows whether Abdul Rashid Abdul Waheed is pakistani or qatari. There maybe more arabs than we think there are in these teams. Mohammed Tauqir is Emirati. Ameet Sampat from Oman is an omani national. I’m sure a couple of the Bahraini boys are locals. One point is clear though, the locals in the gulf have to become alot more involved.

  4. August 17, 2006 at 10:40 am

    Population pyramid is like that only in UAE (50-55% south asians), and in Bahrain (40%)…… Qatar is next with 20%……. the other countries, Kuwait, Saudia and Oman all have around 9-10% South Asian population…..

    UAE also has born and bred players in their line up….. 4-5 of them…… but their team is still primarily expat based……… however, their problem is not as accute as the others…….

    There are NO Arabs in the Gulf teams, and apart from UAE, there are no born and bred players in the other teams either…… except for 1 Omani national of south asian origin in the Oman team………. there is no Arab even in their U15 or U19 teams…….. in fact, I was reading in one of the newspapers that the Arabs are now sticking to their own communities and do not want to play cricket in the UAE in order to maintain their identities in the face of growing south asian immigration…….. they want to play soccer because it differentiates them………

    We cannot ignore country social structures and say that cricket WILL ALWAYS EXPAND THROUGH EXPATS like it did in South Afirca, Australia, India, West Indies etc…….. in the gulf it seems to me that Arabs deliberately dont want to play cricket because to them its the game of South Asian community over there……………

    Even when the ECB makes the schools leagues, only the non Arab schools participate…… even in the U10 level…….. I think thats pretty bad, no other country does that……….

    We have been hearing for 30 years that they WILL take the game to the nationals…….. its all fluff…….

  5. Bruce Gaskell
    August 17, 2006 at 2:18 pm

    Given then, that the South Asian population of UAE is at least 2 million, does it not follow that the cricket team underperforms somewhat? As we know they play a lot of amateur cricket amongst themselves, so one could guestimate that they have at least as many Cricketers as New Zealand, and far more than Ireland or Kenya.

    Sorry if this covers old ground but- The very nature of The South Asian population here means that it is far more concerned with earning money than playing Cricket. Perhaps this means that, in a generations time, once they are a predominantly settled, native born population, they are more likely to build up a decent Cricket structure themselves. Hopefully then the team would become more than just a bunch of Indian/Pakistani fans taking free holidays now and again to play Cricket.

    By extension hopefully the same thing would happen in Canada, the rest of the Gulf, even the USA. So perhaps the ICC is right not to come down hard on expat teams, as long as the expat communities intend to stay PERMANENTLY.

  6. August 17, 2006 at 3:11 pm

    It underperforms big time my friend…. UAE team would probably lose to New Zealand domestic sides, which have much less population feeding them, and the facilities are similar (UAE does have exceptional facilities, even better than test playing Zimbabwe)…….

    What you are saying is ICCs logic…… my question is, this should have ALREADY happenned, given that South Asian immigrants started going to the Gulf in 1974 in the biggest numbers………. South Asian migration to US and Canada started in the 60s, and at least 2 million cricketing expats had been in the US BEFORE this current dotcom migration in the late 1990s …….. but still you have an expat based team, the same as the 1979 ICC Trophy team…… ICC has to incorporate the fact that South Asian kids tend to get mainstreamed instead of spreading cricket over in North America…… I dont think thats a bad thing….. its a good thing, and they should integrate…….. its basically ICCs fault in this way of thinking……

    The other question is about seriousness…….. mainstream americans are able to professionalize their circuits with following numbers of 100K-200K in any sport or game (look at lacrosse or dodgeball for that matter….. or even the stupid hot dog eating contests)…….. UAE, USA, Canada cricket have not been able to even get people in semi pro situation despite UAE having 2 million South Asians, and both the North American countries having 3 million South Asians each (and despite being there for 30 years) ……… UAE has as many football followers as cricket followers, but look where their standard is in both games… and look at the status of the players…….. why?? and it has nothing to do with class structure……. the same ‘working class’ shows up in thousands to watch India Pakistan games………… there IS a problem of focus in UAE/Canada/USA, and the ICC has to incorporate that in their thinking………

  7. Nishadh Rego
    August 17, 2006 at 7:04 pm

    Both UAE and Canada have been associates for donkeys years. The reason they have not progressed beyond that stage is because of the lack of a system of professionals and support from the government. I presume both of these will come as the locals get involved.

    Then again how do you explain a country like Malaysia, Argentina, or Uganda. Malaysia have even given contracts to their senior team. They have been stuck below UAE, Nepal, and even Hong Kong for too long.

    a comment or two from you guys?

  8. Nishadh Rego
    August 18, 2006 at 6:46 am

    You haven’t added a news update for day 5 of the ACC Trophy so i thought i would update the scores and add a few comments.

    Both Kuwait and Saudi Arabia made a mockery of Bhutan and Brunei, which strengthens the view that such countries should not be playing against each other. Kuwait 451/8 Saudi 499/6. I was somewhat encouraged by the fact that Bhutan and Brunei actually managed to score over 150, and weren’t 20 allout, which indicates that they should some resolve in the context of the situation.

    Thailand thoroughly disappointed me today. After a decent batting performance against Qatar yesterday, the side seemed to fold too easily. From what I know of the side, they are much better than the scoreline suggests, and to be frank, I am disappointed and bordering on anger. Our bowling hasn’t been a strong point in this tournament because we are missing three of our main bowlers, and though that is not a completely valid excuse, it has some plausibility. This however, was one of our strongest batting sides, and the way it folded today, indicates an utterly poor performance. A major trend in the mentality of this team is that we do not have the confidence in beating or competing closely with teams like AFghanistan and UAE, and when you go into a game with that frame of mind, you are bound to lose it. Once again, todays performance was pathetic.

    Maldives on the other hand once again proved to everyone how unpredictable the ACC hierachy is. Singapore who crushed Oman, yesterday were in the doldrums today against Maldives, who if had batted would have probably won the game. Moosa Kaleem, Mohd. Aflah, Afzaal Faiz and Abdulla Shafeeu, in my opinion, would have managed the total. This is the reason why, apart from Iran, Bhutan, Myanmar, and Brunei, cannot be split up into divisions!!!

  9. August 18, 2006 at 10:18 am

    Rego….. at least Iran, Myanmar, Brunei, Bhutan can be taken out and put in a qualifying league (along with China etc.)………. one team from there can go ahead………. it would probably reduce the number of teams in ACC Trophy to 12, and that can be split up in 2 groups……. that may be a better strucutre than the current one……

    And I dont quite understand the question you are asking about Malaysia above……

  10. Ram
    August 18, 2006 at 8:48 pm

    Rego…

    Even I had this doubt about Malaysia for a long time…I mean they’ve (along with Singapore, Hong Kong) been ICC members for long, even hosting ODIs in the mid 90s but am not sure if they’ve really made progress over the last 2 decades or so though I believe they now have mainstream players that make up a strong U19 team…I think Argentina and Uganda are more recent phenomena, benefitting from the ICC’s development program though it must be said that it’s a case of re-emergence of the sport in Argentina since the lofty days of the early 20th century…

  11. Nishadh Rego
    August 19, 2006 at 1:27 am

    My point about Malaysia was backed up by their 8 wicket loss to UAE today. They’ve been ICC Associates for 35 years and were founding members of the ACC, however they seem to have gone nowhere with their senior team in the last 5 years.

    On the other hand, I think UAE, Nepal, and Afghanistan are emerging as the 3 clear favorites to win this tournament. Nepal seem to be handing Hong Kong a good hiding as we speak (Hong Kong 68/6 chasing 212), while Afghanistan thrashed both Qatar and Thailand. UAE underlined their dominance with a resounding win today over the hosts. In all likelihood we will see this

    Nepal vs Oman or Bahrain
    Singapore vs Hong Kong or Kuwait
    UAE vs Qatar
    Afghanistan vs Malaysia

    semis:
    Nepal vs Afghanistan
    UAE vs (Singapore Hong Kong or Kuwait)

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